26 April 2010
Five minutes with David MacLeod and Nita Clarke
In 2008, David MacLeod, author of the government report and Nita Clarke, director of the IPA, were commisioned by the department for business (BIS) to produce a review on employee engagement and its potential benefits for organisations and employees. Nishwa Ashraf caught up with the pair to talk about the respoponce towards The MacLoed Report.
What’s been the reaction since the report came out?
David MacLeod: How we’ve put it together seems to have resonated with so many of the audiences. There’s been an almost universal support for, as Nita puts it, the four enablers. Before we started 46% of SMEs said this [employee engagement] was an important or very important topic, now, since the report came out, 60% of SMEs say it’s an important or very important topic. Recent research from the MORI survey among leading chief executives say their top issue isn't recession or innovation but retaining the commitment and motivation of their key people, so we’re very gratified that the topic has moved up the agenda. Although we still have a long way to go to get to the leadership community who are the critical community at the top.
Nita Clarke: The other thing we’ve been pleased about is the practical support that we’ve developed is now freely available and has been so enthusiastically welcomed. We’ve been told by particular small to medium sized organizations that they really welcome having free support and advice like this, which enables them to build their own engagement approaches.
Leading chief executives say their top issue is retaining the commitment and motivation of their key people.
Has anything concrete been delivered from the report so far?
NC: The tools and techniques on the business link website – they are huge. This is saying to people who want to begin the engagement journey, here’s some very practical ways of doing it, you don’t have to spend a fortune, you can do it yourself.
Have you come across any organizations that didn’t do anything with engagement prior to the report and now are looking at ways to implement what you’ve found into their strategy?
DM: We’ve had people from the public sector who’ve now singled their research on the basis of which these four enablers are getting right. We’ve had all sorts of feedback both from the research and anecdotally that people are using it to think about their own approach to the topic.
What are you doing to keep the report recommendations alive?
NC: We do three or four events a week. We go around the country talking about this [employee engagement] to try to get the message out as much as we can. We’re also talking to politicians about the topic, so whoever wins the election understands that employee engagement is a key tool for the British economy and the public environment sector.
DM: We’re trying to make sure the support continues. Although, because there’s only two of us, so we can’t turn up for a group of five, somewhere 400 miles away, but if people have got significant audiences either a general one or specific organizational one, then ask and if one, or both of us are available, we’d be delighted to come and talk about it because that’s what we’re committed to do.
Have you come across any managers/leaders who view employee engagement as a fad?
NC: It’s possible that some people are paying lip service to it. The important thing is the light bulb goes off and they get it. That’s why we don’t want it to be done with the latest management fad. They want an understanding - what exactly can employee engagement can bring to the organization and be as wide spread as possible.
We're talking to politicians about the topic, so whoever wins the election understands employee engagement is a key tool for the British economy
How do you explain a successful organization that has never implemented employee engagement? How does employee engagement correlate with a successful business?
DM: Different people are prepared to devote different levels or better their career. There are some who want to be a chairman or chief executive and some who just want to do nine to five and no more. There are natural commitments, some live to work and some work to live, but wherever you put yourself on a life choice; you’ll be more or less a contributor depending on how you’re managed. You’ll never make someone who just works to live and comes in at 9am and leaves at 5pm change that much. And that’s fine. But if we can encourage high levels of commitment then could organizations that are currently successful be more successful? Would more people do more things for the customer rather than just the minimum?
NC: The key is that organizations find a way for themselves. People can understand our report but they only act on their own beliefs and all we can do is bring it to peoples attention. Nobody can force an organization and nor should we, that’s the whole point, this is about how you choose to organize yourself in a corporate fashion or a public sector. All we can say is, “we think there’s something in this,” but it’s absolutely up to the individual organization to decide how to handle it themselves
Layoffs, acquisitions, freezes - the recession has changed many things for businesses. How is something like engagement going to replace something like a pay rise. Is it a consolation prize?
DM: Sometimes you’re going to have to do layoffs, how you do them do them, engagingly or dis-engagingly, will have a profound effect on the performance that follows. Salaries attract people but they typically don’t motivate, they can de-motivate if they’ve done badly. Essentially you’re attracted to the job for it’s salary; once you’re there you’re motivated to well through our four enablers.
Have your say
Has engagement increased in imporatnce within your organisation since the reports release? What is your organisation doing to engage employees post-recession? Are you using the tools and techniques on the business link website to aid your engagement strategy? Share your thoughts on the topic with us below.
Recommended resources:
Essential techniques for employee engagement
How to ensure you're taking the right approach to engagement
How Everest improved engagement in tough trading conditions
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